Black Sheep

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Posts by Black Sheep

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  62

  Discussion w/ Wife: I Welcome Your Suggestions

  by breakfast of champions in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  so these last few wts have definitely eroded my wife's faith in the org.

  she is definitely seeing the bs, and i even overheard her talking openly about it to a family member.

  good for her!.

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  Black Sheep

  Don't let a JW decide the subject unless they have put their foot in it and given you one that you wanted.

  Generally, the subject you should be discussing is the one they have just used a distraction tactic to avoid.
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  67

  Do you detect an underlying sadness ?

  by Phizzy in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  whenever i talk to jw's, and even in some of the jw official videos, i detect a definite vibe of sadness coming off these people.. i am very sensitive to "atmospheres" and to peoples emotional state, you wouldn't think so, because more often than not i do not react to what i detect, i just let people get on with it.. but i do get this feeling that they are sad, probably because very, very, very deep down they realise that it is all false, maybe ?.

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  Black Sheep

  After the funeral for the spouse that they were promised they would live forever with they have to deal with the damage from the doctrine that says that, even if they, themselves, make it through the GT, their partner is to remain celebate and the promise for them is eternity without each other.

  Constant parroting of how nice it will be when they are resurrected is hiding their trauma of knowing that even a quick fondle with their loved one will be forever seen as a sin by their stroppy little god. Their promised 'reward' is more like a punishment, they know they are getting closer to their funerals, and every day is Groundhog Day, with Paradise no closer than it was yesterday.
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  54

  Was I too harsh?

  by chrisuk in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  hello, first let me apologixe for both my spelling and my grammer in advance, both are not my strong points.. i'll keep this short.

  since i've been a child my mother has studied on and off with jw's ( i'm now 34) so i've been around it most of my life, i studied on and off myself for around 10 years.

  thank's to this site and jwfacts i'll never study or step foot inside a kingdom hall again.

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  Black Sheep

  If you want him to leave you alone, ask a question that he doesn't have a sensible answer for, then refuse to let him weasel his way out of giving you an answer. Make him feel guilty for every trick he uses to fool you.

  If he ever tries to talk about a different Bible subject, inform him that he hasn't answered your original question and you want to know why .... right now .... plus you still want it answered .... now would be a good time.
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  43

  Need advice: Witnessing to a JW at my door

  by Faithful Witness in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  i have been waiting for this moment, and it has finally come!

  i was actually in the middle of typing in the other thread, about householders who caused you doubts, when a jw rang my doorbell.

  my barking german shepherd didnt scare him away, but did knock all his books out of his hand and onto a wet porch, which i really felt bad about.

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  Black Sheep

  I told him I'd been doing some research about TTATT, and that ...

  Resist the temptation to show your hand.It is better to appear naive than to try and impress him with your repository of anti-JW 'propaganda'

  Write your questions down by all means, but don't ask them. The only questions worth asking a JW are the ones you already know their rote answers for, and how to expose those answers as fraudulent. If you don't know what his answer should be, research it in their literature, or here, whatever, just don't ask him.

  If his answer isn't in keeping with WT doctrine, don't ask us if he was correct until you have sent him off to get the evidence to back up his assertion. It doesn't matter if he is correct. He needs a few 'wins' to keep him coming back, but if he is wrong, he needs to do the research to prove it to himself far more than he needs your reasoning for why you don't believe him.
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  43

  Need advice: Witnessing to a JW at my door

  by Faithful Witness in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  i have been waiting for this moment, and it has finally come!

  i was actually in the middle of typing in the other thread, about householders who caused you doubts, when a jw rang my doorbell.

  my barking german shepherd didnt scare him away, but did knock all his books out of his hand and onto a wet porch, which i really felt bad about.

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  Black Sheep

  A friend of mine told me that her brother, an athiest, kept two young JW men coming back for two years. He knew nothing about JW, or their doctrines, he just kept asking questions. Eventually they left the church.

  My point is, it's not a quick process. Most JWs have been indoctrinated for their whole lives, so don't expect to see a result in a thirty minute conversation.
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  8

  For Anyone With the WT CD ROM

  by breakfast of champions in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  my curiosity is killing me, and i don't have access to a cd rom right now, so here's my question:.

  how many "hits" does "144000" get in the magazines over the past 5 years or so?.

  my prediction is that mention of "the 144000" has been decreasing steadily over the past few years, as they move towards phasing out a literal interpretation of this scripture.. thanks,.

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  Black Sheep

  They are printing less, and smaller, mags, so you might get similar results for "and"
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  43

  Need advice: Witnessing to a JW at my door

  by Faithful Witness in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  i have been waiting for this moment, and it has finally come!

  i was actually in the middle of typing in the other thread, about householders who caused you doubts, when a jw rang my doorbell.

  my barking german shepherd didnt scare him away, but did knock all his books out of his hand and onto a wet porch, which i really felt bad about.

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  Black Sheep

  If you really want to witness to them, don't do anything to frighten them off. They are not on your doorstep to listen to you, they are there to save your life by teaching you their religion and you need to let them think that they are doing that. You must be a prospective convert, not an opposer, a sheep, not a mythbuster.

  You make too many statements for him to take issue with and some of those statements are just your subjective opinion and are debatable. e.g. "Oh! So you have been through this kind of upheaval before... I think this is going to be a historic time in your religion's history.". They don't see it that way at all. All through their history there have been changes, all high control groups do it. They are conditioned to it. If you are going to express an opinion, try to make it one that you already know they agree with.

  Ask a question you know he will want to answer, then shut up and make him do the talking, the thinking, the research. If you have asked a good question he will use all manner of tactics to not answer it and you have to really be on the ball if you are not going to let him off the hook. You need him to want to give you a sensible answer to that question, to make impossible promises that he thinks he can keep, statements that he can't find literature he trusts that support them, etc..
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  16

  I need some assistance!

  by Kool Jo in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  i just found out that a co-worker of mine is a ex-jw....she's being pressured to go back to the khall...she says everytime she goes to visit her family, they're telling her how jehovah still loves her...blah blah blah...thankfully she has her own apartment!.

  i do see how her upbringing in the cult has affected her...she's soft and overly kind, but she's a real sweetheart...the down side: people take advantage of her.. should i tell her that i too am a jw and understands what she's going through with her family or should i just tell her that "spirituality is a personal thing and don't feel guilted into doing something you don't want" ect....the thing is, she talks alot and if i tell her that i'm suppose to be a jw, then the entire workplace will know.... what should i do?

  my only aim is to have her not feel guilted in going back...she said her family has been trying to get her back in, but she's resisting it...the other issue, her son stays with her jw sister (she didn't disclose why)...and my co-worker tells me that her son is becoming a "jw convert".. please i need some advice!.

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  Black Sheep

  Don't tell her anything. Especially don't unload a whole bucket load of WT crap on her. Technique is much more important than the info you want to unleash.

  She has to do the thinking and the talking, not you. The more you try and do it for her, the greater the chance that she will block you out and run back to the KH.

  Ask her a simple question that you already know the WT hasn't given her a sensible answer for, then shut up except to keep her on topic and honest. Ask it in such a way that she will really want to answer it.
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  10

  What do witnesses say to you that it is a sign of great tribulation coming?

  by Iamallcool in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  when i was little, some older brother told me there will be a very important annoucement from bethel.

  he said it might be start of the great tribulation.

  i got so worried.

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  Black Sheep

  Most of them are too embarrassed to bring up their worn out 'signs' in my presence
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  8

  CD or copied WT article when reverse-witnessing?

  by NeverKnew in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  so, a couple of weekends ago, i, a non-jw, went to my non-jw cousin's house and lo and behold, two witnesses showed up.

  amongst the many random topics, the mediatorship of jesus came up.

  i stated, "...now, in your faith, jesus is not your mediator, correct?

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  Black Sheep

  Get them to take an entrenched position, then challenge them to provide you with the literature to back up that position. Try to do it in such a way that they feel obligated to do it. They think they have a life saving message and that they can save you from their killer god with that message if they put in the effort to convert you, so use that to get promises out of them and to get them to do the research.

  If they don't come back, that doesn't mean you didn't make your point. There might be a very good reason why they didn't front up.